Hello htf,

So, I stopped by cabin john today and was thinking of you! I noticed that there ARE biking signs inside the northernmost section of Cabin John Regional Park (so I was mostly wrong). Based on this, I have changed the access to "designated" for biking and foot, for most of the ways in this section.

thanks,

arichnad

Understood, and I agree with everything you said. I probably just missed it. Thanks!

Hello Belle Haven Mapper,

Is the Tot Lot gone these days? I tried to find this back here, and couldn't see it, but I don't go here very often.

I see it in the USGS 3D Elevation Program and I see it in the strava heatmap, but I do not see it on the ground, but maybe I went past it without noticing it. Or maybe it's gone now?

Thanks in advance!

arichnad

Hello heretofore,

https://montgomeryparks.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/04/Cabin-John-Regional-map-2023-0502-letter.pdf

This map states that biking and foot are designated.

Also, lol, I didn't delete those pictures. Here's a picture of this park:

https://imgur.com/2p5Ryb6

I have a bunch of these (2024), and none of them have the "access types" (the access types signs you mention are further south) but the map link above is sufficient (IMO).

> Didn't one of those trails have a MTB jump line mapped previously?

Ooooh, I didn't see that. I took this picture in 2020 and my memory is that there are a few "bridge like" mtb things:

https://imgur.com/NCPAIwa

If there's a jump line, please, let me know!

Thanks,

arichnad

Hello heretofore,

Yes, I agree. highway=path says "used by pedestrians, small vehicles like bicycles, for animal riding or livestock walking". On the other hand, the wiki does also say "All paths should ideally have access tags"

Also, I can't find it now, but somewhere it says something about adding access if you know it, regardless of the default, and not to remove it. Or something along those lines?

> I think I used to have `designated` values here that someone removed

Wow! Yeah. That's too bad. I must have missed that. I took some pictures of the signposts, but I think I deleted them: my memory is that this park does not have the "mode" (biking/foot/horse) information on them. Maybe? I forget. The ones on the other side of Democracy Boulevard do, I remember that.

Thanks for the discussion!

arichnad

Hello Heretofore,

I noticed you removed "bicycle=yes" and "foot=yes" in this changeset. I'm not sure I understand this change, I think you're allowed to walk here and bike here.

Thanks in advance!

arichnad

You're right, my mistake. I understand openhistoricalmap, but I had often seen people leaving parts of the Capital Crescent Trail here as an example (one of many):

way/1308494381/history

I've since familiarized myself with the wiki and I see your position. "There is much debate over what exactly counts as recognizable" Certainly, the remaining parts of this railway are still visible, and verifiable. But also, very hard to see.

Regardless, I've manually undone this edit, thanks!

> basing edits on headmap data in this way ends up not being helpful ... I’m begging you to stop making edits just based on heatmap data.

I'm going to be just only slightly defensive here: I don't. I don't edit just based on heatmap data. I did it here, you're right, but, like I've made a lot of edits the past 10 years and something like ~99% of those edits were based on multiple sources of data: usually one of the sources is being physically on the dirt where the trail exists. I record hundreds of GPS recordings per year where I walk and ride. I even rode very near this trail in August when I made these edits, as you and I discussed in 2025, but sadly, as you noticed, didn't make it over to this particular trail.

Now that I'm done being defensive, this is definitely a screw up on my part. So I've effectively undone my changes for the most part: setting this trail as under construction based on your words above.

If you're reaching out to MORE, let me know here, and if not I'll send a message to the MORE trail liaison.

Thanks,

arichnad

Hello again, Nater,

No prob. I'll be totally honest, I haven't been here. In August (2025) I was hanging out a bit south of here as we discussed earlier. I based the "main section of this trail is open" comment on the heatmap information I was able to find. (I don't think I'm able to attach screenshots here, so to see the heatmap data, you have to have a strava account.) Definitely hundreds or thousands of people on foot and on bike are going through this section. I haven't seen the signage at either end of this trail though, sadly, which is why I left the other access tags unset.

Thanks!

arichnad

Wow, sorry I never replied to this! I have discussed this with who I assume made the complaint, if the complaint was in 2021. I think we came to a common understanding for these paths in 2021, but also they did stop replying to my questions so I'm not 100% sure. Thank you for the note.

Hello Nater,

It's a small section of trail (700 feet long) and hardly worth mentioning.

I marked it as abandoned:highway=path here:

way/1426456597/history

If you didn't notice the trail change, it could be because you didn't swing back close to Benway Court / Bryan Mills Way.

It was "discovered" by me: someone who works for the park or MORE painted over the red blazes with black blazes, and I assume it's not a black trail :) If you look at the strava heatmap, nobody on "cycle" is taking it anymore as it is marked as no longer red.

I discovered it on 2025-08-31 and I assume it's why the cut-through trail was opened in the first place, the cut-through was blazed with red, and it seemed like a new trail to me.

If you've been back there near Bently Court and Bryan Mills Way and you think the trail is open, I'd be 100% fine if you marked it as open, but you should remove the "name=Red Trail" tag.

thanks,

arichnad

Hello,

I have fixed this mistake.

Yes it was my typo, ooops. Sorry for the mistake, and thank you very much for catching it!

arichnad

Hello roberthiciks03,

cyclestreet=yes does not feel right here?

"Bicycles are the primary users of the street, while motor vehicles are secondary"

cyclestreet=*

I really do love the enthusiasm, but I don't think this cyclestreet definition jives with these Charles County and St. Mary's County roads. I have read the 2023 MDOT LTS study.

thank you,

arichnad

ps: I have been considering adding "cyclestreets" to my map here: https://cyclemaps.org/

Hello secutanudu,

Thank you for your response. I reached out to MORE (I imagine we are both members) and they had paragraphs of responses. They recognized my name and apologized for the bike lane race being cancelled today!

I have a combination of responses from three people at MORE. Since this comment is an open forum, I will send them to you in a private message. Summary: no, the values in Trail Forks are not correct and/or no name (so something along the lines of "Wakefield MTB Trail System"?) is the official name.

Please, let me know if you do or don't see the private message from me. I'd be happy to move the names back to what they were, but I'd like to hear back from you first. Thanks again!

arichnad

Good morning, secutanudu.

I'm looking for these trail names on other sources and I can't find them. Do you know where I can find them on an official website? I've checked the ground and do not see the trail names there. Thanks in advance!

arichnad

I love it when I notice some new bike lanes that aren't on OSM, and go in to add them, and I find that someone added them just days before. Nice job, thanks!

I reverted this, thanks!

changeset/161042840

Hello ericfromson,

I undid some of this change. It appears to have some issues: node/11246259374 seems to be in the wrong location.

I understand there's a new foot-crossing here? Can you please let me know where I can see this crossing? Do I need to go here to see it, or is it in some satellite imagery?

Thanks!

arichnad

Hmmmm, interesting! Thank you for the note: I had not heard of super-route. I'll definitely use that in the future and it seems easy enough.

Source for the horse=no wooden structure on path (way/94413718)

https://www.nps.gov/choh/planyourvisit/horsebackriding.htm