Changeset: 107521106
Changed "roundabout" to a traffic-calming island, since the feature has stop-signs along 27th and no right-of-way markers along Salmon. Hopefully this will cause navigation to avoid saying "take the roundabout at roundabout" when it gets here.
Closed by Jeffrey Yasskin
Tags
changesets_count | 1 |
---|---|
created_by | iD 2.19.6 |
host | https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit |
ideditor:walkthrough_progress | welcome |
ideditor:walkthrough_started | yes |
imagery_used | Bing aerial imagery |
locale | en |
review_requested | yes |
Discussion
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Comment from archpdx
Hi,
Welcome to OpenStreetMap! After looking at street-level imagery it seems that this intersection is a 'mini-roundabout'. Unlike roundabout ways, mini-roundabouts can be used on nodes and should also fix the navigational error you mentioned in your changeset comment. I've changed the traffic island node you created to this.
-archpdx
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Comment from Jeffrey Yasskin
Thanks! I'd excluded 'mini-roundabout' because its wiki page says "the middle can be traversed by vehicles", and this type has a tree in the middle, but I'm happy to use that instead for future changes.
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Comment from pdxrider
Hi everyone,
Jeffrey is correct on interpreting the meaning of mini-roundabout. Since these islands can't be traversed by vehicles (in other words, going straight through a painted island) and instead are physical islands, mini-roundabout is not appropriate. I suggest restoring the circular ways and tagging them with junction=circular (https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:junction%3Dcircular) instead, so it can be shown as a circular junction without calling it a roundabout. (solution stolen from (https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/102013909), I'm not the only one here). Hope this helps.
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Comment from archpdx
Hi, thanks for your suggestion. I'll change the
three intersections that were changed to junction=circular ways. -
Comment from Jeffrey Yasskin
I think I was right with traffic_calming=island. https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:traffic_calming%3Disland#How_to_map shows an example photo that looks very similar to the intersections along Salmon. There's no circular flow of traffic here, or circular shape to the roadway, just a circular shape to the island. Minh's comment in https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/102013909, that they want to describe the vegetation within the island, seems like a general problem for islands, but I don't see it mentioned in https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:traffic_calming%3Disland. I'll bring it up there.
The main practical effect I'm hoping for is that navigation software stops mentioning these intersections when giving directions, since they aren't that kind of interruption in a driver's experience. Having it say "take the second exit from the circular junction" wouldn't be any better than "take the second exit from the roundabout".
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Comment from archpdx
I don't think traffic islands would be appropriate here as there are signs for right-of-way directing traffic counter-clockwise around the island. The example you pointed out on the traffic island wiki page shows an island without any ROW signage. The wiki page for roundabouts (wiki.osm.org/Tag:junction=roundabout) shows that roundabouts could be used on nodes, which could be a compromise. It might fix your issue and directional tags could be added to the node.
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Comment from Jeffrey Yasskin
Thanks for the discussion. I also double-checked at https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:traffic_calming%3Disland#Distinguishing_between_calming_islands_and_circular_junctions and on Slack, and got a wider consensus that these should be marked as traffic circles, so I updated some wiki pages to be clearer about that.
Ways (5)
- Southeast 27th Avenue (5525421), v17
- Southeast Salmon Street (117150881), v18
117160506, v18117160529, v17143113716, v9
Relations (2)
Nodes (1-20 of 32)
- 1
- 2
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