Nakaner has commented on the following diary entries

Post When Comment
railway=tram m( 21 days ago

Ich kann dein Problem nicht ganz nachvollziehen. Das Zitat trifft auf das gezeigte Bild nicht zu, da es keinen separaten Gleiskörper gibt. Hier mappt man einen Way in der Mitte für die Straße und daneben je einen für jedes Gleis.

Over 75, 000 schools imported in Peru! about 1 month ago

Hi dannykath,

the license section on the Import documenation page (the whole page should be in English for an import of that size) is very short and doesn't proof that OSM is allowed to use and distribute the data. If your import had a proper import discussion on the Imports mailing list as required by the Import Guidelines you cited, people would have told you that you need a proper permission and that you have to document it.

Could you please upload the letter of permission by the Ministry of Education?

Best regards


Maps Update: 17th of April 3 months ago

The shrinkage of Portugal was caused by my revert of a large undiscussed import. See the dicusssion of and the thread on the Talk-pt mailing list linked from there.

Simple script to bulk add non redundant tags on boundary=administrative ways 3 months ago

Automated edits like the one you propose are governed by the Automated Edits Code of Conduct. You have to discuss such edits on the communication channels mentioned by the guideline.

Ways of administrative boundaries don't need to be tagged if the are only boundary lines and don't represent any other feature. Editors with proper styling will show these lines as boundary lines even if they don't have any tags. In addition, experience tells us that other mappers will break boundary relations even if they are rendered as such.

What is an import? 3 months ago

Well, this applies to all but the first four items on your list. And the fourth one is questionable.

The forth item (I should have written "key", not "tag) is an easy way to find users importing shape files. As you might know, field names of shape files are limited to 10 characters. Sometimes things go completely wrong and people end up uploading objects with uppercase keys or keys ending with ~1.

Again, I am pretty sure you cannot tell a proper import from a regular edit. Regarding the source cirteria, you never know what a mapper used for tracing or tagging, the same as with imports.

That's not wrong. I have difficulties and write changeset comments even if I am sure. There are HOT mappers uploading thousands of buildings in one large changeset.

What is an import? 3 months ago

I agree that the size alone is not helpful. I regularly check my OSMCha filters for changesets with more than 9000 additions and many of them are HOT mappers tracing buildings and uploading them after they finished editing.

jremillard wrote:

An import is any addition to OSM that directly derives from other digital map sources.

I would append:

without or with limited use of ground surveys and aerial/satellite imagery.

Otherwise people will try to define Bing imagery as a "digital map source". :-)

However, that criteria is difficult to translate into rules a computer can apply. That's my personal list of criteria to define a bad import:

  • Use of strange tags
  • uppercase tags
  • coordinates as tags
  • no tag is longer than 10 characters
  • no discussion on imports@ mailing list
  • too short time between first posting to imports@ and start of the import
  • obvious and large copyright violation
  • no entry in the imports catalogue, no documentation on the wiki
  • no usage of a dedicated account for imports

Unfortunately, our rules don't require users to add a tag to the changeset indicating the documentation and discussion of the import. If so, we could look for changesets which look like imports but lack that tags. I would call these tags:

  • import:documentation=<page title at wiki>
  • import:discussed:<mailing_list>=<date of first posting on imports@ mailing list>
The effect of the new iD release on restrictions 4 months ago

@Zverik Thank you for counting the numbers.

Did you checked some of the new turn restrictions with a via way member manually to ensure that they really need a way as a via member? Maybe the UI of iD needs to be improved because its users understand it wrong? (I don't remember a lot of real world examples where a restriction needs a via way)

Issues with Japan imports 4 months ago

Hi bdiscoe,

you might have a look at following mailing lists discussions:

Best regards


When the World Needs a Map, Give them a Database 5 months ago

If OSMF offered commercial services, I had to move all its servers to new data centres and pay the prices which were usual for hosting. This means, before OSMF starts earning money it has to invest a lot. Where would this money come from?

In addition, a central provider of OSM based services would harm the competition. There is some competition between the companies offering OSM services but they compete less by price but more by design, features, support and quality.

Search Engine Optimization Destructive Edits 5 months ago

@Glassman Could you please add links to changesets (as "proofs")?

I think that SEO companies who don't use proper tagging or even delete existing data as described by you shold not be treated as a normal newbie. It is their job and they are paid for by their customers to do a good job. If they are unable to introduce themselves to OSM in advance and learn how our project works, a full revert is the right response. This might sound harsh but that's the lesson they will quickly learn.

There is one main difference between other commercial contributors to OSM and SEO companies. The "normal" companies use the contributed data themselves. It is in their own interest that OSM becomes better. However, a SEO company gets paid one single time to enter their customers into a few dozens of databases, OSM is one of them.

Modellierung von Ausfahrten 6 months ago

Hallo Daniel,

ich glaube, deine Blogeintrag wird verständlicher, wenn du ihn mit Schildern/Bildern aus dem deutschsprachigen Raum "lokalisierst". Wobei man dazu sagen muss, dass Ausfahrten ohne Verzögerungsstreifen (dein Beispiel) bei uns selten sind und nur noch auf einzelnen gelben Autobahnen und nahezu unveränderten Reststücken von Reichsautobahnen (z.B. Pforzheim Ost) vorkommen.

Viele Grüße


Network Rail - Sectional Appendix 6 months ago

That's great. Where can I find this dataset?

Are they aware that attribution will be only visible at and neither at nor at any web site which uses OSM?

DevonshireBoy42 wrote:

Would attributes similar to highways for speed limits and restrictions be suitable. Or would we need a new restriciton schema?

It is very similar to roads. Use maxspeed=* if both directions of a track have the same limit, use maxspeed:forward=* and maxspeed:backward=* otherwise. If tilting trains may run faster in a curve, add maxspeed:tilting=*. Don't forget to add mph.

Please don't import these speed limits before assuring their quality. Railway operators in some countries have two different definitions of a "speed limit". On the one hand, there is the speed limit of a whole railway line which is either the the fastest speed limit of the whole line (even if this section is relatively short). On the other hand, there is the — I call it real speed limit — which train drivers have to obey to prevent damages. These real speed limits depend on the radius of curves, the distance between distant and main signals, the quality of the track and ballast and other factors. If you know a few locations with relatively low speed limit, check them in the dataset.

Btw, you might cross-post to

OSM Provided Services Are Not a Safe Place 7 months ago

IknowJoseph wrote:

I am a long term subscriber to 3 OSM mailing lists (talk, since 2009, I think; HOT since day 1; OSMF-talk since 2012) and all three have recently been dominated by a very small group of people engaging in the short-term, dopamine-driven feedback loops described above. There have been examples of racism, bullying, harassment, as well as a number of conspiracy theories and statements made that are bizarre to the point that they have to be outright questioned to make sure we're all reading the same words.

Could you please point me to examples of racism on one of these three mailing lists?

What is harassement and bullying from your point of view? This email?

I would like to point out that the definition of harassment varies between different cultures. What an American might consider as harassment might be ok for people from Europe. The international mailing lists are multi-cultural and have lots of contributors who are not native English speakers. If a CoC forces them to express criticism in a very polite way, it will become more difficult or even impossible for them to participate in discussions.

Metro Mapping Proposal (and what's wrong with proposals) 8 months ago

Hi Ilya,

it was not my intention to chase you away from public transport mapping. Public transport tagging is a difficult topic if you go beyond mapping of buses. Due to the difficulty and the nitpicking character of some self-proclaimed "experts" (like me), people are very picky and aim perfect proposals.

The main problem of you proposal was and still is that it is a mix of a useful guide and some tagging changes. Proposals which only contain the changes don't invite the large audience to read. But proposals which contain too much context hide the changes.

Zverik wrote:

For one person, it's because I should have discussed the proposal in his 3-messages-a-month mailing list, not in talk@ and tagging@.

That is an example of a excessive nitpicking which is not encouraging and not commendable. You posted a lot on the mailing lists about your proposal and that shows that you have good intentions. If I remember correctly, WeeklyOSM mentioned your proposal one or two times. If you miss a minor special interest mailing list, it is a minor formal defect and could be cured by posting a link to the proposal on the mailing list and extending the voting period for two weeks.

Zverik wrote:

Deprecating? They have always been recommended to map stations as nodes, until your silent edit a year ago to one of the pages. Of course it's safer to edit circumventing a proposal stage, since nobody could oppose the change. I just read the wiki and put what I found in the proposal.

Hey, that's not Martin's fault, it's me being the bad guy. I did some wiki fiddling which has been reverted later by Martin and I regret it.

Zverik wrote:

For a mapper things also looked bleak: to map a subway properly, you would have to know how underground tracks go, and where underground platforms are located.

What about introducing some kind of "trackless route relation", i.e. relations which are build like PTv2 route relations but don't contain all tracks because they are unknown? I think that we should not use route=* to avoid confusion and to make it possible for validators to distinguish between intended and unintended absence of the tracks. That's why I suggest to use incomplete:route=train/subway/… + incompleteness_state:tracks=incomplete.

Best regards


Creating a ground map (Schwarzplan) 9 months ago

Maperitive ist das Einsteigerprogramm zum Kartenrendern. In dem verlinkten Forenthread findest du sogar den Quellcode eine Schwarzplan-Kartenstils für Maperitive. Alles was du jetzt noch tun musst:

  • Mapertive herunterladen und entpacken
  • OSM-Daten herunterladen und zuschneiden (oder einen Extrakt auf erzeugen lassen), Format: osm.pbf
  • OSM-Daten in Maperitive laden
  • Kartenstil anwenden (ich glaube der Befehl load-ruleset [PARAMETER] gefolgt von apply-ruleset)
  • Karte rendern mit export-png oder export-svg

Weitere Details findest du in Tutorials sowie in der Maperitive-Dokumentation.

Creating a ground map (Schwarzplan) 9 months ago

There is a plenty of results if you google "Schwarzplan OpenStreetMap". Because you mention the German term, I am sure that you are able to read German forum discussions, e.g. this.

To be (re)moved? Altkleidercontainer in Berlin - OSM-Datenqualität abseits von Straßen und Adressen 9 months ago

Zu regionalen Quests gibt es schon ein Ticket auf Github.

To be (re)moved? Altkleidercontainer in Berlin - OSM-Datenqualität abseits von Straßen und Adressen 9 months ago

@RoterEmil Mit einem regionalen Quest meinte ich ein Quest (eine Aufgabe) mit regionaler Begrenzung. Dafür könnte man einerseits als örtliche Community mehr Werbung machen und andererseits wäre die in vielen Fällen sinnvolle Diskussion im Forum/auf Mailinglisten vor der Einführung der Aufgabe nur auf regionaler Ebene erforderlich. Zudem muss man bei regional begrenzten Aufgaben weniger Sonderfälle und örtliche Eigenheiten betrachten – der Aufgabenautor kennt sie ja schon.

Neuer Schwung nach 8 Jahren 9 months ago

Hallo raibach,

es gab schon Versuche, die hessische Vermessungsverwaltung zur Freigabe zu bewegen, aber soweit ich weiß, scheiterte es am Unwillen im Ministerium. Man muss es einfach hinnehmen, dass manche Ministerien, die für die Vermessungsverwaltung in ihrem Land zuständig sind, etwas weiter sind als andere. Die einen springen auf den Zug auf und erkennen langsam, dass sonst der Zug an ihnen langsam vorbeischleicht, die anderen haben leider Scheuklappen und warten darauf, bis alle BOS-Organisationen in ihrem Land auf einfacher zu lizenzierende Datenquellen umgestiegen sind.

Der Benutzer DD1GJ, der unser Behördenbeauftragter ist, kann dir da mehr dazu erzählen.

Es ist im Rückblick betrachtet unser Glück, dass die Vermessungsverwaltungen sich erst seit etwa fünf Jahren langsam öffnen (nur Bayern hat deutlich früher angefangen). Dadurch haben wir Deutschland noch einmal neu von Grund auf erfasst, die Fehler der Vermessungsverwaltungen vermieden (wir haben fünf Kategorien für Waldwege, die Ämter zwei) und eine Community gebildet, die eine persönliche Beziehung zu ihren Daten hat und dadurch stärker motiviert ist, die Daten zu pflegen. Das ist vermutlich einer der Hauptgründe, warum die deutsche Community überproportional stark in OpenStreetMap ist.

Viele Grüße


To be (re)moved? Altkleidercontainer in Berlin - OSM-Datenqualität abseits von Straßen und Adressen 9 months ago

Harald, die Idee lag mir gerade auch auf der Zunge, aber in dem Falle wären regionale Quests unter Umständen besser. Ein globaler Quest würde nicht schaden, lokale binden aber u.U. Leute an die bestehende örtliche Community (Stärkung des Wir-Gefühls usw.).