Tordanik has commented on the following diary entries

Post When Comment
Thought experiment: What if values had no keys? 3 months ago

I also tend to find the "artificial buckets" annoying. Not only do they make tags harder to remember and cause discussions about which bucket to put something in almost every time we invent a new tag, they can also lead to misunderstandings about the meanings of a tag. Particularly infamous in this regard is the "natural" key, which has a tendency to make people assume that they are only allowed to tag "natural water" or "natural peaks" with those tags.

In theory, it would be possible to get rid of the problem without an API change by introducing a special key such as "feature". The values of that key would then be the feature's type such as "park" or "farmyard". Replace the arbitrary small buckets with a single big bucket. But it would still be a massive change that is unlikely to ever happen, sadly.

Units in OpenStreetMap almost 2 years ago

Personally, I try to always add units to avoid any ambiguity. Sure, defaulting to SI units makes sense. But when some keys want meters as the default (e.g. maxheight), others want kilometers (e.g. distance), and again others want centimeters (e.g. the proposed step length), then mistakes will happen. Always adding the unit is easy and fixes that issue.

Units in OpenStreetMap almost 2 years ago

Personally, I try to always add units to avoid any ambiguity. Sure, defaulting to SI units makes sense. But when some keys want meters as the default (e.g. maxheight), others want kilometers (e.g. distance), and again others want centimeters (e.g. the proposed step length), then mistakes will happen. Always adding the unit is easy and fixes that issue.

New road style for the Default map style - the first version about 2 years ago

@escada: Sure, you will get different results depending on whom you ask. But it's not automatically true that Germans will prefer orange-red motorways. I'm German, but I've never had much exposure to Michelin maps. (I'm probably too young.) So to me, blue seems like a perfect colour for motorways.

No joy this weekend about 3 years ago

That's not an enviable situation you are in. It's always annoying when we have to fix mistakes of new contributors instead of spending the time on mapping.

There's one thing I wonder about, though: If there are only 2 active mappers in that metropolitan area, where does all the data come from? Have there been other contributors in the past that are no longer active? From your post, it sounds as if you are maintaining much more data per user than mappers in my area are.

Fixing common & possible Tagging Mistakes about 3 years ago

Popular validation tools such as the JOSM validator or Keepright are grouped by location (i.e. presented on maps), which allows me to look for errors in my local area and check them one by one.

Compared to this, I feel the solution of adding a lot of Taginfo/Overpass links across the wiki isn't really useful because I would have to open each link individually, just to learn whether there is any instance in my area (with only about 100 instances globally, probably not). These entries in the wiki can only effectively be used for mass edits, which we don't want.

So I would prefer if you didn't add your findings as (likely never-ending) tasks to the wiki, but instead contacted the people behind existing quality assurance tools.

Trolle about 3 years ago

Oh je, das sind keine schönen Erfahrungen. Wenn man etwas umbaut, dann sollte man auch darauf achten, dass nichts kaputt geht.

Bei den maxspeeds am Node habe ich allerdings eine Vermutung, was im Kopf des Users vorgegangen ist: Die meisten Fälle, wo maxspeed an Nodes hängt, entstehen nämlich, weil jemand beim Hinzufügen der Tags zu einem Way versehentlich die Nodes mit ausgewählt hatte. Womöglich ist dem User gar nicht eingefallen, dass damit Verkehrszeichen gemeint sein könnten.

Daher habe ich einen Tipp: Schau dir mal den Schlüssel [](traffic_sign) an. Wenn du z.B. noch traffic_sign=maxspeed an deine Verkehrszeichen-Nodes setzt, dann sind deine Verkehrszeichen hoffentlich idiotensicher. Und du machst es gleichzeitig eventuellen Auswertern leichter.

My one problem with OpenStreetMap over 3 years ago

There's also the issue of getting the millions of $€£ per year that are required to serve a big customer base. Maybe donations or something would work, but we don't really know that.

CAPTCHA problems in the Wiki over 3 years ago

If anyone wants to check, the whitelist is here:

Connecting Communities With Improved OpenStreetMap Credits on Mapbox Maps over 3 years ago

Much better. Thanks!

DuckDuckGo Places now uses OpenStreetMap! over 3 years ago

I also think this style of attribution goes too far. I'm fine with clicking for attribution, but giving special treatment to your own logo in that manner is just not ok.

However, It's great news that DuckDuckGo uses OSM!

Multipolygon over 3 years ago

Du hast die 3704346 mittlerweile ja gelöscht, aber ein klarer Fehler war, dass du die runde Wasserfläche mit der Rolle "outer" eingebunden hattest, obwohl es sich nicht um eine äußere Umrandung handelt. Richtig wäre hier "inner".

Hey guys. over 3 years ago

Mapping these footpaths separately from the street could be a problem for routing applications. There is a bit of a controversy about whether they should be mapped as a separate way or simply as a sidewalk=left/right/both tag on the road, which I don't want to talk about here too much. However, if you are going to map these separately, you need to connect them to the road (with a shared node) everywhere where one might want to cross the road, and at every driveway etc. crossing the footway.

Other than that, I didn't spot any obvious errors. Mapping fences before buildings is an unusual decision, but setting those priorities is up to you, of course.

OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike over 3 years ago

Even though I don't agree with every single argument made in the diary entry, I would appreciate if OSM adopted a different license along the lines of the CC-BY or even CC0 (although the latter is probably not realistic).

It may not be obvious to everyone, but as soon as you try to build something with OSM beyond mainstream use cases like 2D rendering, the ODbL frequently becomes a highly annoying obstacle. I was under the impression that OSM was supposed to enable a broad range of commonplace and creative uses, but the current license hampers that mission.

Money for OSM over 3 years ago

Thanks for your effort maintaining this source of money for OSM, Malenki! I try to use the affiliate ids whenever possible.

Zuviel des Guten over 3 years ago

Ich finde Detailverliebtheit nicht einmal das Problem in diesem Fall - wenn dadurch wirklich nutzbare Daten hinzukämen, könnte man gerne Gehsteige separat mappen. Das eigentliche Problem ist, dass die Frage der praktischen Nutzbarkeit komplett ignoriert wird und daher sogar Funktionalität verloren geht!

Konkret: Wie soll der Router bei getrennt gemappten Gehsteigen noch wissen, dass ich eine verkehrsarme Straße an jedem Punkt überqueren kann? Wie soll er noch "folgen sie der X-Straße auf der rechten Seite" ansagen können? Wie soll ich im Renderer - 2D oder 3D - lückenlos an die Straße anschließende Gehsteige als solche darstellen können?

Mit sidewalk-Tags ist alles oben genannte möglich, mit separaten Ways nicht. Wo ist da die Verbesserung?

iD Newbie friendly feature request over 3 years ago

Perhaps there should be some kind of integration with GeoChat for JOSM, too?

Openstreetmap und Wikidata over 3 years ago

Sehr schönes Beispielprojekt, zeigt gut die Möglichkeiten, die in Wikidata stecken! Seit ich Wikidata entdeckt habe, bin ich absolut überzeugt, dass sich da Synergien zu OSM ergeben müssen.

Anders als du würde ich mir allerdings schon wünschen, dass wir doppelte Arbeit weitgehend vermeiden, eine Ähnlichkeit mit Wikipedia-Relevanzdiskussionen sehe ich beim Wunsch nach Koordination zwischen zwei freien Projekten auch nicht gegeben. Meiner Meinung nach ist OSM von der Software und Kultur her am besten für Recherche vor Ort geeignet – und natürlich generell für geografische Daten. Wikidata wäre eher für Dinge, die man über Quellen- und Literaturrecherche findet. Nach dieser persönlichen Abgrenzung sehe ich dann auch population (inklusive historische Bevölkerungszahlen etc.) eher als Aufgabe für Wikidata.

Trotzdem hast du natürlich recht, dass man Zugeständnisse für technische Anforderungen machen muss.

OpenStreetMap - Increasing diversity over 3 years ago

I would like the OSM community to become more diverse, but I would not like the foundation to choose goals – no matter how noble – and impose them onto the community. The current activities of the Wikimedia foundation are actually a rather negative example in my opinion, because they appear to be done mostly in a top-down fashion, the exact opposite of how a community-driven project with minimal formal organisation should work. Your ideas feel similar to me, so I'd rather not see them implemented, sorry.

"Anyway, as you say it's a do-cracy. And I have mapping parties to organise..."

That's the spirit! :-)

Attribution and all that (a rant) over 3 years ago

Well, if we dropped the various restrictions regarding the precise appearance of the attribution, we could magically turn a lot of incorrect attribution into correct attribution overnight. I feel it is generally irrelevant whether the attribution says anything about "OpenStreetMap Contributors" or just "OpenStreetMap", whether it includes the © sign, and whether it is in a corner of the map, on the bottom of the page or behind a link. The proper attribution for OSM looks exactly like the usual legalese you see on the internet all the time, so users will habitually ignore it anyway.

What brings in new mappers is when an application is nice enough to dedicate a popup or two to alerting its users to OSM, or when the developers blog about it, or when users recommend the great OSM map files to each other, or if the application is popular enough to get us press coverage. Attribution helps very little with all that, except for one thing: It serves as an easy proof that this cool application is made with OSM data, which can be helpful for our own PR and recruiting efforts. But having an "OpenStreetMap" anywhere that we can point to is enough for that purpose.

tl;dr: Let's focus on those who do not provide attribution at all, and relax about the details.